tekmoe
Sep 19, 07:38 AM
apple store isn't down yet. I don't expect it today like a lot of people do
i agree. i think the store would have went down already. next monday has got to be it.
i agree. i think the store would have went down already. next monday has got to be it.
EagerDragon
Aug 27, 02:55 PM
All these changes are also likely to see a departure from the standard Alum shell. There will probably be a new attractive enclosure to separate the lines. Almost instant load of applications along with all the extra speed of Leopard on a sweet Meron chip with all the new iCandy and functionality will likely make me pull my credit card. Can't wait for next summer!!!!!!
Bring it ON!!!!!!!:)
Bring it ON!!!!!!!:)
sierra oscar
Sep 19, 09:19 AM
AMEN!!!! This whole thread has the tone of a spoiled 13 year old's "I want" tirade. All the benchmarks show little difference between Merom and what you can buy today...and the 64 bit argument is really moot for most users because....(ready for it)....it's a laptop! Very few will have more than 2GB RAM on it anyway, and addressing larger RAM partitions is the #1 64 bit advantage.
That whole comment had the tone of a spoilt 13 year old...
You have no idea why some ppl are waiting for the next revision or upgrade - don't benchmark your rationale with others in way that dismisses other ppl who have equally legitimate reasons and opinions...
Some ppl (who don't have allot of money to drop every year for the next best thing) have to spend wisely - and perhaps just want a revB machine that is more stable and refined. I for one keep my macs until they die...so I will be waiting for revB to maximise my chances of a solid bug-free machine.
If that makes me spoilt - b/c I don't want to purchase new products year after year - then there is nothing I can do about your perceptions...
That whole comment had the tone of a spoilt 13 year old...
You have no idea why some ppl are waiting for the next revision or upgrade - don't benchmark your rationale with others in way that dismisses other ppl who have equally legitimate reasons and opinions...
Some ppl (who don't have allot of money to drop every year for the next best thing) have to spend wisely - and perhaps just want a revB machine that is more stable and refined. I for one keep my macs until they die...so I will be waiting for revB to maximise my chances of a solid bug-free machine.
If that makes me spoilt - b/c I don't want to purchase new products year after year - then there is nothing I can do about your perceptions...
magbarn
Apr 9, 09:23 AM
Intel did indeed force Apple to use their IGP by not licensing other vendors to provide IGPs. The reason the MBP 13" and MBA 13" use IGPs and not dedicated GPU is one of space. Apple can't magically conjure up space on the logic board.
I push the GPU more often than I push the CPU on my MBA. I doubt I'm in the minority, though I'm probably part of the minority that actual knows this little fact. ;)
No matter how much you try to spin this, Intel got greedy on this one and couldn't back their greed with competence. They have sucked at GPUs since they have been in the GPU game (Intel i740 anyone ?).
I don't think 2IS is getting that IF Intel allowed Nvidia to continue making sandy bridge chipsets, Nvidia could've easily integrated a 320m successor into the south bridge. This would give you the best of both worlds, the downclocked Low-voltage Intel HD graphics when on battery or basic surfing, or the 320m successor in the south bridge when playing games or aperture photo editing. All this WITHOUT raising the motherboard chip count that putting a separate discrete (on it's own, not integrated into the chipset like 320m) would entail.
I push the GPU more often than I push the CPU on my MBA. I doubt I'm in the minority, though I'm probably part of the minority that actual knows this little fact. ;)
No matter how much you try to spin this, Intel got greedy on this one and couldn't back their greed with competence. They have sucked at GPUs since they have been in the GPU game (Intel i740 anyone ?).
I don't think 2IS is getting that IF Intel allowed Nvidia to continue making sandy bridge chipsets, Nvidia could've easily integrated a 320m successor into the south bridge. This would give you the best of both worlds, the downclocked Low-voltage Intel HD graphics when on battery or basic surfing, or the 320m successor in the south bridge when playing games or aperture photo editing. All this WITHOUT raising the motherboard chip count that putting a separate discrete (on it's own, not integrated into the chipset like 320m) would entail.
hyperpasta
Aug 5, 04:49 PM
WWDC = World Wide Developer Conference.
= Not Consumer Stuff.
It's been mentioned before... :rolleyes:
BREAKING: ThinkSecret reports (http://www.thinksecret.com/news/wwdc06preview.html) that new iPod nano's/iTunes movie downloads have been pushed back to September!
ThinkSecret has a track record of being vaguely right, but messing up the details of reports. I'd bet they have the iPod announcements right, but the order messed up. Or something like that. Movie downloads would probably be shown along an iPod that could play movies... duh. As in, the new true video iPod. I'd put my money on iPod nano/iMac Conroe/Price-dropped Mac mini at one event and True Video iPod/iTunes Movies/MBP Merom at another. Or something like that.
But I'm off topic. Point is, I think we can forget about new iPods monday.
= Not Consumer Stuff.
It's been mentioned before... :rolleyes:
BREAKING: ThinkSecret reports (http://www.thinksecret.com/news/wwdc06preview.html) that new iPod nano's/iTunes movie downloads have been pushed back to September!
ThinkSecret has a track record of being vaguely right, but messing up the details of reports. I'd bet they have the iPod announcements right, but the order messed up. Or something like that. Movie downloads would probably be shown along an iPod that could play movies... duh. As in, the new true video iPod. I'd put my money on iPod nano/iMac Conroe/Price-dropped Mac mini at one event and True Video iPod/iTunes Movies/MBP Merom at another. Or something like that.
But I'm off topic. Point is, I think we can forget about new iPods monday.
dsnort
Aug 7, 04:41 PM
As a recent switcher to Mac, I have had a lot of experience with M$'s System Restore function. It is NOT a "go back and find that data I deleted" application. It IS a "can we please go back to a time when this computer wasn't totally ********* up" application.
NJRonbo
Jun 14, 11:38 AM
Yeah it's strange. I called them back. They
don't have anything in their system one way
or another but told me to stop in tomorrow and
they will check the system.
Store is on my way to work so I don't mind.
don't have anything in their system one way
or another but told me to stop in tomorrow and
they will check the system.
Store is on my way to work so I don't mind.
freeny
Aug 7, 04:25 PM
I really dont give a cr@p who made what first or who stole this or that. All I care is that it works....
Ja Di ksw
Aug 25, 05:15 PM
I would just like to say that every time I have dealth with Apple's help (blue line on screen, crack on trackpad, melted power brick cord, ordering, etc), they have been superb. Very professional, very helpful, and very quick. Does this add much to the discussion? No, but too often we only hear the bad, so I wanted to put in some good as well.
zero2dash
Sep 18, 01:44 PM
Plenty of people ran NT on their desktops.
Admission of your mistakes is a good step in becoming a better person.
Key word being DESKTOPS.
MP machines were server based long before they were included in desktops. I'd like to see where people had dual Xeon based DESKTOPS 'cause I've never seen it. It's not impossible but it's also not a good cost-based answer either. :p
The server/desktop division with Windows - as with OS X - is one of marketing, not software. Windows "Workstation" and Windows "Server" use the same codebase.
I never said otherwise.
The hardware they run on is where it differentiates.
Most people/corporations run server-based OS on servers and workstation-based OS on desktops (or "workstations" in the business world). It's not impossible to run a server OS on a desktop or a workstation OS on a server but it is incredibly stupid.
Well, if you can't find evidence of Windows running on well on machine with >2 processors, or of the significant low-level changes Microsoft have made to ensure it does, you aren't looking very hard.
Bad dual core support? Citations please. I think this is a case where a Mac fan is simply speaking out of ignorance of their "enemy" platform.
I erronously bundled in "dual core" with "sketchy 64-bit support". Don't know why. From what I hear, 64-bit support in XP64 is sketchy because of device driver issues (and drivers not being natively 64-bit). I don't have any true 'dual core' systems myself but my P4 3.0C HT works fine in XP Pro. I apologize for lumping in "dual core" in.
Similarly, if you're one of the "Vista is just XP with a fancy skin" crowd, you've obviously not done much research. The changes in Vista are on par with the scale of changes Apple made to NeXT to get OS X.
User Account Protection is a big change. I've seen the list of "new features" and it doesn't do anything for me. UAP is nice...it's just really late. I'm sure there's changes "under the hood" like the ones implemented in XP sp2 to prevent buffer/stack overflows, etc. and I'm sure that's what you're referring to.
I think people who say stuff like that are exhibiting a syndrome common to Mac folk who've never spent any time in the PC world -- they take negative comments they remember regarding versions of Windows or the PC experience from about 5 years back and assume they apply to today. XP, for example, really was for the most part a window-dressing of Windows 2000, but that is not the case for Vista. You see similar statements regarding "blue screens of death", overall system stability, etc, which suggest they haven't seen or used a PC since the late 90s/early 00's.
So - are you inferring that Windows 2000 or Windows XP never blue screen? Because (if you are) that's a load of crap. I've seen blue screens in both OS's. Granted it's usually tied to hardware only, but it still happens. I've had an external USB drive blue screen in XP every time I turned it on, tried on 3 XP computers. Hardware fault, no doubt. Lately my HP Laptop dvd drive has been causing XP Pro to blue screen every other time I insert a dvd-r. Again - hardware fault.
Otherwise are both OS's stable? Damn straight. But problems do occur and I hope you're not suggesting otherwise. No OS is without its flaws.
Admission of your mistakes is a good step in becoming a better person.
Key word being DESKTOPS.
MP machines were server based long before they were included in desktops. I'd like to see where people had dual Xeon based DESKTOPS 'cause I've never seen it. It's not impossible but it's also not a good cost-based answer either. :p
The server/desktop division with Windows - as with OS X - is one of marketing, not software. Windows "Workstation" and Windows "Server" use the same codebase.
I never said otherwise.
The hardware they run on is where it differentiates.
Most people/corporations run server-based OS on servers and workstation-based OS on desktops (or "workstations" in the business world). It's not impossible to run a server OS on a desktop or a workstation OS on a server but it is incredibly stupid.
Well, if you can't find evidence of Windows running on well on machine with >2 processors, or of the significant low-level changes Microsoft have made to ensure it does, you aren't looking very hard.
Bad dual core support? Citations please. I think this is a case where a Mac fan is simply speaking out of ignorance of their "enemy" platform.
I erronously bundled in "dual core" with "sketchy 64-bit support". Don't know why. From what I hear, 64-bit support in XP64 is sketchy because of device driver issues (and drivers not being natively 64-bit). I don't have any true 'dual core' systems myself but my P4 3.0C HT works fine in XP Pro. I apologize for lumping in "dual core" in.
Similarly, if you're one of the "Vista is just XP with a fancy skin" crowd, you've obviously not done much research. The changes in Vista are on par with the scale of changes Apple made to NeXT to get OS X.
User Account Protection is a big change. I've seen the list of "new features" and it doesn't do anything for me. UAP is nice...it's just really late. I'm sure there's changes "under the hood" like the ones implemented in XP sp2 to prevent buffer/stack overflows, etc. and I'm sure that's what you're referring to.
I think people who say stuff like that are exhibiting a syndrome common to Mac folk who've never spent any time in the PC world -- they take negative comments they remember regarding versions of Windows or the PC experience from about 5 years back and assume they apply to today. XP, for example, really was for the most part a window-dressing of Windows 2000, but that is not the case for Vista. You see similar statements regarding "blue screens of death", overall system stability, etc, which suggest they haven't seen or used a PC since the late 90s/early 00's.
So - are you inferring that Windows 2000 or Windows XP never blue screen? Because (if you are) that's a load of crap. I've seen blue screens in both OS's. Granted it's usually tied to hardware only, but it still happens. I've had an external USB drive blue screen in XP every time I turned it on, tried on 3 XP computers. Hardware fault, no doubt. Lately my HP Laptop dvd drive has been causing XP Pro to blue screen every other time I insert a dvd-r. Again - hardware fault.
Otherwise are both OS's stable? Damn straight. But problems do occur and I hope you're not suggesting otherwise. No OS is without its flaws.
33scottie33
Aug 27, 02:06 PM
That is interesting because I ordered a Macbook on Tuesday (the 22nd) and mine is also scheduled to ship on the 31st. It is suspiciously strange and hopefully it means that we'll get Meroms because I was waiting for the Merom MBP when I decided to just order a Yonah MB.
I ordered a 17" MBP on Thursday and it originally had a ship date for the 31st. Then today I got an email with a tracking number saying that it shipped today.:confused: I was hoping that mine would be a Merom too, but it does not look like it. The delivery date is now the 30th; I'll try to not open it for a couple of days or until I hear some new news.
I ordered a 17" MBP on Thursday and it originally had a ship date for the 31st. Then today I got an email with a tracking number saying that it shipped today.:confused: I was hoping that mine would be a Merom too, but it does not look like it. The delivery date is now the 30th; I'll try to not open it for a couple of days or until I hear some new news.
Popeye206
Apr 11, 11:28 AM
Cool... I'll wait. Nothing wrong with my iPhone4 and in September/October I'd have a better chance of an early out with AT&T.
Besides... with it being delayed until September, maybe we'll get more than we think with the iPhone 5 update? iOS5 should keep us busy over the summer anyway with new toys for our current iPhones. :)
Besides... with it being delayed until September, maybe we'll get more than we think with the iPhone 5 update? iOS5 should keep us busy over the summer anyway with new toys for our current iPhones. :)
wpotere
Apr 28, 06:45 AM
Wow, this thread and the ridiculous nature of this issue are hilarious. Seriously, you wonder why the US is going down the pan when the entire nation seems to get caught up in a fight over a bloody birth certificate?
Amusing isn't it?
Amusing isn't it?
MacinDoc
Aug 27, 03:23 AM
the iMac will get a conroe. Nothing can be as dumb as putting a laptop chip in the desktop iMac. If the iMac could hold a G5 in it, it sure can hold a Conroe chip.
So, does a dual core Conroe produce less heat than a G5? Remember, the iMac is essentially a laptop form factor, so heat dissipation is more difficult. I agree, though, it will get a Conroe chip, as long as it is cool enough.
So, does a dual core Conroe produce less heat than a G5? Remember, the iMac is essentially a laptop form factor, so heat dissipation is more difficult. I agree, though, it will get a Conroe chip, as long as it is cool enough.
grum
Sep 19, 09:26 AM
All you people who keep whining about "But I want 64 bit!!!" need to step back and think about what possible benefit a 64-bit system will give you. Those of you who need to address more than 4 gigs of RAM are excused. The rest of you, tell me WHY you need 64-bit computing.
When they go Merom I want the MBP's and MB's to have useful, practical features. More ports, user-removable hard drive, better battery life, better video card, stuff like that. I'm waiting just as impatiently as everyone else, but the hype needs to be toned way down.
why does anyone need to justify to you why they want 64-bit computing?
When they go Merom I want the MBP's and MB's to have useful, practical features. More ports, user-removable hard drive, better battery life, better video card, stuff like that. I'm waiting just as impatiently as everyone else, but the hype needs to be toned way down.
why does anyone need to justify to you why they want 64-bit computing?
macpross
Aug 6, 11:28 PM
Great joke, thanks very much...in the same line as Tiger Computer Dealers, right?
We already have a Mac Pro line of products, we are also the owners of AppleLocks, and MacMice. The Tiger thing was silly.
We already have a Mac Pro line of products, we are also the owners of AppleLocks, and MacMice. The Tiger thing was silly.
KPOM
Apr 6, 02:25 PM
I am shocked that anyone finds this as a positive.
So you all want a drop from 1.86/2.13 to 1.4GHz CPUs in your 13" MBA? That is a 30% drop.
Uh, megahertz myth, anyone? Based on the 2.3Ghz Core i5 in the MacBook Pro, I'd expect the 1.4GHz Core i5 with hyperthreading to be significantly faster than the 1.86 or 2.13GHz Core 2 Duo. Plus, it can turbo boost to 2.3GHz.
Then you want another drop of approaching 50% in graphics performance? Remember these IGPs clock in much lower than the STD voltage SB used in 13" MBP.
That is a legitimate concern. That said, if you aren't a gamer, the CPU may more than make up for it. Plus, we all know Apple can't use the Core 2 Duo forever, and is taking some heat for still using it now.
capabilities!
So you all want a drop from 1.86/2.13 to 1.4GHz CPUs in your 13" MBA? That is a 30% drop.
Uh, megahertz myth, anyone? Based on the 2.3Ghz Core i5 in the MacBook Pro, I'd expect the 1.4GHz Core i5 with hyperthreading to be significantly faster than the 1.86 or 2.13GHz Core 2 Duo. Plus, it can turbo boost to 2.3GHz.
Then you want another drop of approaching 50% in graphics performance? Remember these IGPs clock in much lower than the STD voltage SB used in 13" MBP.
That is a legitimate concern. That said, if you aren't a gamer, the CPU may more than make up for it. Plus, we all know Apple can't use the Core 2 Duo forever, and is taking some heat for still using it now.
capabilities!
Willis
Jul 27, 01:45 PM
I havent checked yet to see if someone mentioned it, but in regard to what people expect to see at WWDC, dont worry if it isnt annouced then... Paris Expo is in September.
Mac Pro's might come out then i think.
Mac Pro's might come out then i think.
Iconoclysm
Apr 20, 06:18 PM
Actually, anyone above the age of six knew about Apple Records.
We all lived and breathed vinyl back then :)
You're right, but I don't even know why I'm arguing this point - using a logo from a record label for a computer company is not nearly the same thing as using another computer company's designs to make products that compete with it.
We all lived and breathed vinyl back then :)
You're right, but I don't even know why I'm arguing this point - using a logo from a record label for a computer company is not nearly the same thing as using another computer company's designs to make products that compete with it.
baeder
Jul 15, 01:19 AM
Is it possible that the lower end models (rumored to be single processor) will be upgradeable by BTO or later on by the user by putting in another processor?
Yanwoo
Aug 6, 02:00 PM
Was just trying to price out an IMac on the Apple store and the option of upgrade the keyboard/mouse to a wireless version was gone??
Something new in the offing to be announced tomorrow perhaps??
Something new in the offing to be announced tomorrow perhaps??
Mr_Ed
Mar 31, 04:33 PM
Gruber is rarely accurate in his conclusions, and this time is no exception.
None of what is happening smacks of being a "bait-and-switch" as he claims. That would've required extremely clever pre-planning years ago on the part of Google.
Instead, it's got all the hallmarks of too little pre-planning.
Anyone with experience dealing with large projects can see that Rubin has belatedly come to realize that things were getting out of control. Now he is goofing up trying to take full control himself instead of doing the smart thing and first getting a consensus from the OHA members.
I don't think it's about planning. After all, how much "planning" do you need to do if your philosophy behind the product is basically " open it up so everyone can contribute and see where it goes"? The point most here are making is that the age-old "open" vs. "closed" ecosystem argument, which has repeatedly been used to criticize Apple over many years, is now looking more and more as if Apple was right all along. In this case what you call "lack of planning," I call lack of much thought at all. I for one don't have much faith in most things accomplished by committee, and that is the basic flaw in most "open" systems.
The "bait and switch" reference applies in that many of those who jumped on the Android bandwagon now find they don't have nearly as much control as they thought they would, as evidenced by the complaints from that community.
None of what is happening smacks of being a "bait-and-switch" as he claims. That would've required extremely clever pre-planning years ago on the part of Google.
Instead, it's got all the hallmarks of too little pre-planning.
Anyone with experience dealing with large projects can see that Rubin has belatedly come to realize that things were getting out of control. Now he is goofing up trying to take full control himself instead of doing the smart thing and first getting a consensus from the OHA members.
I don't think it's about planning. After all, how much "planning" do you need to do if your philosophy behind the product is basically " open it up so everyone can contribute and see where it goes"? The point most here are making is that the age-old "open" vs. "closed" ecosystem argument, which has repeatedly been used to criticize Apple over many years, is now looking more and more as if Apple was right all along. In this case what you call "lack of planning," I call lack of much thought at all. I for one don't have much faith in most things accomplished by committee, and that is the basic flaw in most "open" systems.
The "bait and switch" reference applies in that many of those who jumped on the Android bandwagon now find they don't have nearly as much control as they thought they would, as evidenced by the complaints from that community.
yfile
Apr 6, 11:38 AM
What do you mean true 3D? Motion 3 integrated 3D reflection, shadows, depth of field, etc.. It was around that time I stopped using After Effects. There are still things that AE can do that Motion can't, but that's mostly due to 3rd party plugins.
I mean 3D objects with materials, textures, shaders, better lighting, better shadows, no crashing several times a day...
3D like ProAnimator FX or Kinemac at least. No plugin required.
I mean 3D objects with materials, textures, shaders, better lighting, better shadows, no crashing several times a day...
3D like ProAnimator FX or Kinemac at least. No plugin required.
Super Dave
Aug 5, 06:35 PM
Recall that Tiger features saw significant UI overhauls (Dashboard, Spotlight, Automator) from the original Tiger demos at WWDC until it's reshowing at Macworld. Apple has no reason to rush this out after WWDC.
You can bank on 07. First Half. No sooner than April.
You're right that there is "no reason to rush" except it would be awfully fun to beat Vista to market AGAIN.
David :cool:
You can bank on 07. First Half. No sooner than April.
You're right that there is "no reason to rush" except it would be awfully fun to beat Vista to market AGAIN.
David :cool:
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