Stridder44
Apr 13, 01:44 AM
So this is basically a jazzed up Final Cut Express and the pros have been shown the door. Why am I not shocked about this. :mad:
Someday I'll tell my kids that Apple was the company for pros to which they will laugh in disbelief; kind of how I do now when old people tell me that American cars were once high quality.
Please, be more dramatic. :rolleyes:
This is an amazing update. It's everything FCP has needed for a long time. And you're upset because it looks like iMovie? I swear, it doesn't matter what Apple does, whenever there's an update by Apple there will always be people like you who will NEVER be happy. I'm surprised you aren't complaining that it's not a free download. Stop acting like a victim. No one is holding a gun to your head forcing you to buy it.
Someday I'll tell my kids that Apple was the company for pros to which they will laugh in disbelief; kind of how I do now when old people tell me that American cars were once high quality.
Please, be more dramatic. :rolleyes:
This is an amazing update. It's everything FCP has needed for a long time. And you're upset because it looks like iMovie? I swear, it doesn't matter what Apple does, whenever there's an update by Apple there will always be people like you who will NEVER be happy. I'm surprised you aren't complaining that it's not a free download. Stop acting like a victim. No one is holding a gun to your head forcing you to buy it.
lazyrighteye
Oct 7, 12:21 PM
The SDK is limited only to the Apple OS, granted, it relies on hooks, however, you are alienating a hell of a lot of people from developing on the platform.
You say that like it's a bad thing.
Don't we already have enough junk in the App Store?
If not, there are now millions of Flash developers eagerly waiting to do their best (worst?).
In most every other scenario, I'm very liberal... very supportive of openness. But when it comes to developing a tool or utility, like a computer, a phone, etc., I very much fall in the category that appreciates Apple's closed system approach over an Open Source approach. The closed approach helps ensure an efficient & consistent user experience. But I'm also a quality over quantity kind of guy - which clearly does not represent everyone.
You say that like it's a bad thing.
Don't we already have enough junk in the App Store?
If not, there are now millions of Flash developers eagerly waiting to do their best (worst?).
In most every other scenario, I'm very liberal... very supportive of openness. But when it comes to developing a tool or utility, like a computer, a phone, etc., I very much fall in the category that appreciates Apple's closed system approach over an Open Source approach. The closed approach helps ensure an efficient & consistent user experience. But I'm also a quality over quantity kind of guy - which clearly does not represent everyone.
dante@sisna.com
Oct 26, 03:27 AM
OK. I know that many of my apps aren't going to take advantage of this level of multithreaded power, but I can't help but get excited by this development. After so many years of sluggish improvement, it feels like we're in the midst of rapid (and radical) change.
I'm hoping that the 8-core, 3.0 (or faster) GHz MacPro arrives the same day as Leopard and about the same time as CS3. I'd gladly swap my 2.66 GHz quad core...:)
Many of the applications that graphics, audio, and video producers use do take advantage of the extra power. It just happens differently than one might think -- it has via better multitasking. It is up to the user to learn how to use quad and eight core boxes to improve production.
We've been learning this technique for the past year with PowerMac Quad Core and are blown away by how much more work we accomplish.
DJO
I'm hoping that the 8-core, 3.0 (or faster) GHz MacPro arrives the same day as Leopard and about the same time as CS3. I'd gladly swap my 2.66 GHz quad core...:)
Many of the applications that graphics, audio, and video producers use do take advantage of the extra power. It just happens differently than one might think -- it has via better multitasking. It is up to the user to learn how to use quad and eight core boxes to improve production.
We've been learning this technique for the past year with PowerMac Quad Core and are blown away by how much more work we accomplish.
DJO
bpaluzzi
Apr 28, 09:29 AM
Yeah, he seems to have forgotton those personal computers known as the Apple ][, the Commodore PET, the Atari 400 and 800, and so on that predated the IBM PC. He's creating a very limited definition that ignores history.
The way I interpreted his comments was exactly the opposite -- he is specifically mentioning the fact that there are "PC" as in IBM PC ("capital PC"), but there are also "personal computers", such as your examples above (his "lower case pc"). I think we're all saying the same thing, just phrasing it differently.
The way I interpreted his comments was exactly the opposite -- he is specifically mentioning the fact that there are "PC" as in IBM PC ("capital PC"), but there are also "personal computers", such as your examples above (his "lower case pc"). I think we're all saying the same thing, just phrasing it differently.
ryme4reson
Oct 12, 05:49 PM
Can some1 run this from within VPC. I believe that VPC is supposed to emulate the 486, so I am interested in finding out if they process is handled different, even though its a G4. Sure it will not be fast (emulatin) but i would be interested in seeing the results.
EDIT: ddtlm, are you interested in helping me with X86 assembly? I would be willing to pay for your time. Email me at jamesk777@mac.com or IM me at ryme4reson (AOL) Thanks
EDIT: ddtlm, are you interested in helping me with X86 assembly? I would be willing to pay for your time. Email me at jamesk777@mac.com or IM me at ryme4reson (AOL) Thanks
capvideo
Mar 21, 01:37 AM
Digital copyrights are licenses. You do not own the copy.
Where are you seeing a difference between digital copyrights and any other kind of copyright in U.S. law? There is no such difference, and current law and current case law says that purchases of copyrighted works are in fact purchases. They are not licenses.
Your license does not allow you to modify the contents such that it enables you to do things not allowed by law.
No, you've got it in reverse. The Supreme Court of the United States specifically said that anything not disallowed is allowed. That was (among other places) the betamax case that I referenced.
You seem to be conflating the DMCA with copyright. The DMCA is not about copyright. It's about breaking digital restrictions. The DMCA did not turn purchases into licenses. Things that were purchases before the DMCA are still purchases today.
You can't rent a car and break all the locks so that anyone can use it without the keys. If you OWN the car, you can do that.
This is a poor analogy. The real analogy would be that you have purchased the car, but now law requires that you not open the door without permission from the manufacturer.
When you rent a car, the rental agency can at any time require that you return the car and stop using it. The iTunes music store has no right to do this. CD manufacturers have no right to do this.
Music purchases were purchases before the DMCA and they are purchases after the DMCA. There are more restrictions after the DMCA, but the restrictions are placed on the locks, not on what is behind the locks. The music that you bought is still yours; but you aren't allowed to open the locks.
Your analogy with "so that anyone can use it" also misrepresents the DMCA: the better analogy is that you can't even open the locks so that *you* can use it.
Licenses can be revoked at any time. When I buy digital music on CD (all music on CD is digital) there is no license involved to be revoked. It is not in any way like renting a car. It is in every way except my inability to redistribute copies like purchasing a car.
But you do not OWN the music you've bought, you're merely using it as provided for by the owner. Because digital files propagate from a single copy, and that original can be copied and passed along with no quality loss or actual effort to the original copier (who still retains his copy), the law supports DRM which is designed to prevent unauthorized copying.
In the sense that you have described it above, books are digital. Books can be copied with no loss and then the original sold. Books are, according to the Supreme Court, purchases, not licenses. Book manufacturers are not even allowed to place EULAs on their books and pretend that it is a license. There is no different law about music. It's all copyright.
Copying for your own uses (from device to device) is prefectly within your rights, but modifying the file so it works in ways it was not originally intended IS against copyright law.
Show me. Show me the *copyright* law that makes this illegal and that does so because of a *license*.
Are you claiming that playing my CDs on my iPod is illegal? The file has been modified in ways that it was not originally intended: they were uncompressed digital audio files meant for playback on a CD player. Now they're compressed digital audio played back on an iPod.
That is completely outside of what the manufacturer intended that I use that CD for. I don't believe that's illegal; the U.S. courts don't believe that it's illegal. Apple certainly doesn't believe that it's illegal. The RIAA would like it to be illegal but isn't arguing that any more. Do you believe that it is illegal?
Please also consider going back over my previous post and refuting the Supreme Court cases I referenced.
Jerry
Where are you seeing a difference between digital copyrights and any other kind of copyright in U.S. law? There is no such difference, and current law and current case law says that purchases of copyrighted works are in fact purchases. They are not licenses.
Your license does not allow you to modify the contents such that it enables you to do things not allowed by law.
No, you've got it in reverse. The Supreme Court of the United States specifically said that anything not disallowed is allowed. That was (among other places) the betamax case that I referenced.
You seem to be conflating the DMCA with copyright. The DMCA is not about copyright. It's about breaking digital restrictions. The DMCA did not turn purchases into licenses. Things that were purchases before the DMCA are still purchases today.
You can't rent a car and break all the locks so that anyone can use it without the keys. If you OWN the car, you can do that.
This is a poor analogy. The real analogy would be that you have purchased the car, but now law requires that you not open the door without permission from the manufacturer.
When you rent a car, the rental agency can at any time require that you return the car and stop using it. The iTunes music store has no right to do this. CD manufacturers have no right to do this.
Music purchases were purchases before the DMCA and they are purchases after the DMCA. There are more restrictions after the DMCA, but the restrictions are placed on the locks, not on what is behind the locks. The music that you bought is still yours; but you aren't allowed to open the locks.
Your analogy with "so that anyone can use it" also misrepresents the DMCA: the better analogy is that you can't even open the locks so that *you* can use it.
Licenses can be revoked at any time. When I buy digital music on CD (all music on CD is digital) there is no license involved to be revoked. It is not in any way like renting a car. It is in every way except my inability to redistribute copies like purchasing a car.
But you do not OWN the music you've bought, you're merely using it as provided for by the owner. Because digital files propagate from a single copy, and that original can be copied and passed along with no quality loss or actual effort to the original copier (who still retains his copy), the law supports DRM which is designed to prevent unauthorized copying.
In the sense that you have described it above, books are digital. Books can be copied with no loss and then the original sold. Books are, according to the Supreme Court, purchases, not licenses. Book manufacturers are not even allowed to place EULAs on their books and pretend that it is a license. There is no different law about music. It's all copyright.
Copying for your own uses (from device to device) is prefectly within your rights, but modifying the file so it works in ways it was not originally intended IS against copyright law.
Show me. Show me the *copyright* law that makes this illegal and that does so because of a *license*.
Are you claiming that playing my CDs on my iPod is illegal? The file has been modified in ways that it was not originally intended: they were uncompressed digital audio files meant for playback on a CD player. Now they're compressed digital audio played back on an iPod.
That is completely outside of what the manufacturer intended that I use that CD for. I don't believe that's illegal; the U.S. courts don't believe that it's illegal. Apple certainly doesn't believe that it's illegal. The RIAA would like it to be illegal but isn't arguing that any more. Do you believe that it is illegal?
Please also consider going back over my previous post and refuting the Supreme Court cases I referenced.
Jerry
Rt&Dzine
Apr 24, 11:19 AM
Originally Posted by ender land
I have personally thought through my beliefs extensively (likely more and more frequently than most of you have thought through your respective beliefs).
What a condescending statement. :rolleyes:
But it's common to assume that you experience more self-examination than others do. Most people don't verbalize it.
I have personally thought through my beliefs extensively (likely more and more frequently than most of you have thought through your respective beliefs).
What a condescending statement. :rolleyes:
But it's common to assume that you experience more self-examination than others do. Most people don't verbalize it.
D4F
Apr 28, 08:36 AM
We are currently witnessing the melding of the two, with the mobile side emerging as the favoured platform.
Yes, you'll see content creation on tablet and pad devices. It's inevitable as they get more powerful and easier to use.
I agree but they will never match real desktops. Technology advances. Something you can do today let's say in 2 hours you will do in 1 next year on new equipement. Thing is that next year you will ramp up the quality of the final product still getting same 2 hour work period. It's like that for ages and will never stop :)
Yes, you'll see content creation on tablet and pad devices. It's inevitable as they get more powerful and easier to use.
I agree but they will never match real desktops. Technology advances. Something you can do today let's say in 2 hours you will do in 1 next year on new equipement. Thing is that next year you will ramp up the quality of the final product still getting same 2 hour work period. It's like that for ages and will never stop :)
killr_b
Oct 25, 10:48 PM
I can't really decide what to think of an 8 core mac pro.
Right now FCP barely uses all four of mine.
It seriously seems that they a) haven't updated software pending an OS update, ie; leopard, to take advavtage of them or b) more cores really only helps the multi-tasking.
In any case I think my mac pro isn't quite as fast as it could be sighting the activity of my cpus during a render.
HDV render = 60% on every core. WTF?
Right now FCP barely uses all four of mine.
It seriously seems that they a) haven't updated software pending an OS update, ie; leopard, to take advavtage of them or b) more cores really only helps the multi-tasking.
In any case I think my mac pro isn't quite as fast as it could be sighting the activity of my cpus during a render.
HDV render = 60% on every core. WTF?
grubesteak
Sep 26, 12:29 AM
What incentive does anyone ever have to buy if they keep announcing new chips? I'm all for the advancement of new technology, but I'm not forking over any money just yet.
Seems like there's a new "just around the corner" press release/rumor every other week.
Seems like there's a new "just around the corner" press release/rumor every other week.
the Rebel
Mar 20, 10:15 PM
I do agree that it is effectively the break of a promise. Hell, it's the breaking of a contract... which is certainly quite wrong. But what if you believe the original terms and conditions to be morally wrong in themselves?
If you believe the original terms are morally wrong, then you should never agree to abide by them. Once you choose to agree to the terms, then you are morally bound to abide by them.
If you believe the original terms are morally wrong, then you should never agree to abide by them. Once you choose to agree to the terms, then you are morally bound to abide by them.
stcanard
Mar 18, 08:41 PM
Apple sells music only to sell iPods. People are locked into their iPods because their iTunes music can't be played on any other brand of player.
And if you look at the number of iPods sold compared to the number of ITMS songs sold, it is plainly obvious this statement is pure bull.
And if you look at the number of iPods sold compared to the number of ITMS songs sold, it is plainly obvious this statement is pure bull.
R.Perez
Mar 13, 06:52 PM
Did you even read the article you posted? The stored solar energy is drained after 8 hours. Which means if you have a day where the sun is obstructed, your city will black out.
did you actually read my post? Centralized solar would just be one part.
did you actually read my post? Centralized solar would just be one part.
Peace
Sep 12, 04:44 PM
This is the device I said was coming with the exception of the Hard Drive and I bet before it's released it has one.
backinblack875
Apr 8, 10:37 PM
Real games aren't played on an iDevice. Say what you want, it's true at the moment. No need to look into the future..........cause you don't know what it holds. And if you do tell me if i'll be at work Monday please! (Gov worker)
Govt SCUM!! (lol jk :D)
Govt SCUM!! (lol jk :D)
carmenodie
Oct 7, 12:02 PM
You notice that Google's stock is way up! As of this writing it is now trading at $507.29 a share and it is 10-7-09 and 12:56pm. Look, Android is going into all these phones like a who** not b/c it is some supper grand OS but to get Google's share prices up. And believe me it will be ad laced up the a**.
So, is this god news for consumers? Hell no!
It is good news for wall street and stock holders.
Android=lots of ads to plague you with.
So, is this god news for consumers? Hell no!
It is good news for wall street and stock holders.
Android=lots of ads to plague you with.
Tobsterius
Apr 13, 08:01 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8G4 Safari/6533.18.5)
I don't want to claim this or that about myself nor do I want to say that I know this person in LA or whatever.
I get a paycheck for what I do and I love my job.
Now, personally, I am excited about the update, but very concerned about the apps shortcuts and the minor details that makes an NLE a professional level app.
We can calm down about the whiners/drama-queens, and we can calm down about the consumers flaming the pros.
The PROS are concerned not because of anything other than their bread and butter app heading in a direction no one may have asked for. Many of us get paid to get a job done in X amount of time. To save time we remap keys, use shortcuts and 3rd party surfaces and other hardware to speed the edit.
We like change but we like change to be in-tune with what an app needed to give us the competitive edge. We aren't worried about young folks talking a good game but not knowing the difference between CTRL-V and CTRL-M in FCP.
I will save my major comments until I see the shortcut layout, the amount of customization, and hear from the working industry . . . you know the ones too busy getting it done to attend the event. Not the ones that got paid go.
With that said, the CONSUMERS are happy I see because they literally do see this update as candy. Another app they can buy to cut their home movies. The college students see an app they can afford (even though FCE was perfect).
Can we turn off the water works and whiny pro/consumer bashing and get back on topic?
You're 100% correct.
Folks who are criticizing people who are expressing their concern about the new version, please read this post.
I don't want to claim this or that about myself nor do I want to say that I know this person in LA or whatever.
I get a paycheck for what I do and I love my job.
Now, personally, I am excited about the update, but very concerned about the apps shortcuts and the minor details that makes an NLE a professional level app.
We can calm down about the whiners/drama-queens, and we can calm down about the consumers flaming the pros.
The PROS are concerned not because of anything other than their bread and butter app heading in a direction no one may have asked for. Many of us get paid to get a job done in X amount of time. To save time we remap keys, use shortcuts and 3rd party surfaces and other hardware to speed the edit.
We like change but we like change to be in-tune with what an app needed to give us the competitive edge. We aren't worried about young folks talking a good game but not knowing the difference between CTRL-V and CTRL-M in FCP.
I will save my major comments until I see the shortcut layout, the amount of customization, and hear from the working industry . . . you know the ones too busy getting it done to attend the event. Not the ones that got paid go.
With that said, the CONSUMERS are happy I see because they literally do see this update as candy. Another app they can buy to cut their home movies. The college students see an app they can afford (even though FCE was perfect).
Can we turn off the water works and whiny pro/consumer bashing and get back on topic?
You're 100% correct.
Folks who are criticizing people who are expressing their concern about the new version, please read this post.
jiggie2g
Jul 12, 12:51 PM
Smallish mid-tower case
Intel Core 2 Duo @ 2.8Ghz or better
1GB RAM
1-PCIe x16 Slot
1-Standard PCI Slot
6-USB 2.0 ports (One in front)
1- Firewire 800 port (in front)
Dual Layer DVD
Onboard 10/100/1000 (I don't care if its wireless, but a wireless opition would be nice but not necessary)
Graphics Card should be x1600XT or better with 256mb RAM
I want it at or less than $1199.00
Now gimmie
Oh, and P.S. - Don't make me put a Dell 24" LCD on it - Drop the 23" cinema display to $999 and the 20" to $599 - that still leaves you with a nice premium.
Sure u can buy a Tower with those specs(save 4 FW800) I'd rather have eSATA 2(faster). at less $1199.00 except that PC will have a Gateway/HP/Dell logo on it , instead of that cute little Apple. Would u like that Order Supersized... keep dreaming.
I am now convinced that many people who post in these forums are stupid(not refering to u sbarton) , If half these dumb comments went up on Xtremesystems/THG/Anandtech Forums people would get laughed at right out of the forums. Please if you do not have any sort of technical knowledge please do not post ignorant comments about how conroe deserves to go into an iMac and MacPro is too good for it.
I find it very disturbing that while many of the forums I just mentioned are salivating for conroe chips to hit retail , the mac snobs in this forum act like it's some bastardized step child to woodcrest. Lets me tell you noob's something after seeing Coolaler hit 4ghz on a Kentsfield nothing impresses me anymore. lets see your MacPro score 2000 in Cinebench and render in 11secs.
I can't wait till august so when i get my Conore i can break all your hearts. when u see my Conroe clock up at 3.6ghz and blow that overpriced MacPro trash out of the water. Then please tell me that Core 2 belongs in an iMac.
I swear you people deserve to be stuck with IBM/Freescale for another 5yrs.
because the price difference is not that much and it saves apple more on design/engineering/testing/support ect. it makes great financial sense to consolidate your product line into one platform.
I am very disappointed in you Hector , you of all people should know better then to post something like this. Do u not realise that the Intel deal ment apple dosen't have to do it's own R&D anymore when it came to chip sets.
APPLE IS USING INTEL STOCK PARTS incase you didn't know , so mixing the MacPro with Conroe/Woody would not cost a dime more. they will use a basic P965 chipset for Conroe and 5000X Chipset for Woody.
Intel Core 2 Duo @ 2.8Ghz or better
1GB RAM
1-PCIe x16 Slot
1-Standard PCI Slot
6-USB 2.0 ports (One in front)
1- Firewire 800 port (in front)
Dual Layer DVD
Onboard 10/100/1000 (I don't care if its wireless, but a wireless opition would be nice but not necessary)
Graphics Card should be x1600XT or better with 256mb RAM
I want it at or less than $1199.00
Now gimmie
Oh, and P.S. - Don't make me put a Dell 24" LCD on it - Drop the 23" cinema display to $999 and the 20" to $599 - that still leaves you with a nice premium.
Sure u can buy a Tower with those specs(save 4 FW800) I'd rather have eSATA 2(faster). at less $1199.00 except that PC will have a Gateway/HP/Dell logo on it , instead of that cute little Apple. Would u like that Order Supersized... keep dreaming.
I am now convinced that many people who post in these forums are stupid(not refering to u sbarton) , If half these dumb comments went up on Xtremesystems/THG/Anandtech Forums people would get laughed at right out of the forums. Please if you do not have any sort of technical knowledge please do not post ignorant comments about how conroe deserves to go into an iMac and MacPro is too good for it.
I find it very disturbing that while many of the forums I just mentioned are salivating for conroe chips to hit retail , the mac snobs in this forum act like it's some bastardized step child to woodcrest. Lets me tell you noob's something after seeing Coolaler hit 4ghz on a Kentsfield nothing impresses me anymore. lets see your MacPro score 2000 in Cinebench and render in 11secs.
I can't wait till august so when i get my Conore i can break all your hearts. when u see my Conroe clock up at 3.6ghz and blow that overpriced MacPro trash out of the water. Then please tell me that Core 2 belongs in an iMac.
I swear you people deserve to be stuck with IBM/Freescale for another 5yrs.
because the price difference is not that much and it saves apple more on design/engineering/testing/support ect. it makes great financial sense to consolidate your product line into one platform.
I am very disappointed in you Hector , you of all people should know better then to post something like this. Do u not realise that the Intel deal ment apple dosen't have to do it's own R&D anymore when it came to chip sets.
APPLE IS USING INTEL STOCK PARTS incase you didn't know , so mixing the MacPro with Conroe/Woody would not cost a dime more. they will use a basic P965 chipset for Conroe and 5000X Chipset for Woody.
sigamy
Jul 12, 01:58 PM
man, my head is spinning...Yonah, Mermon, Woodcrest, Core Duo 2 (isn't that redundant?)
Don't you just long for the good old days when we'd get one G4 processor for 18 months? ;)
Don't you just long for the good old days when we'd get one G4 processor for 18 months? ;)
Foxglove9
Aug 29, 11:13 AM
Eh, I believe little of what Greenpeace ever says. :rolleyes:
Eraserhead
Mar 27, 04:30 PM
But no one here has proved that Nicolosi is an unreliable representative of his field. If someone proves that Nicolosi is mistaken, maybe no one will need to attack him.
Has he published anything in a peer-reviewed scientific journal of high (or even average) standing?
Has he published anything in a peer-reviewed scientific journal of high (or even average) standing?
alexdrinan
Sep 12, 04:18 PM
It's already there they call it export to iPod.
Well there you go. But I assume it's converting the video to the low res format that the ipod can play. Do they have an export option that keeps it at the same quality it was recorded at?
Well there you go. But I assume it's converting the video to the low res format that the ipod can play. Do they have an export option that keeps it at the same quality it was recorded at?
jefhatfield
Oct 11, 11:58 PM
that's prolly why sj goes ballistic when any reporter mentions anything to that effect...it may be true or ...maybe... apple and steve jobs may be with motorola 100% percent and hate the "ibm talk" because of how it undermines the high end computing relationship they have now
on the low end, the G3 has had a pretty good run and now with the G3fx and 512k level 2 cache, things are good in that sector for some time to come...hopefully
on the low end, the G3 has had a pretty good run and now with the G3fx and 512k level 2 cache, things are good in that sector for some time to come...hopefully
Gelfin
Mar 26, 12:59 AM
sure, homosexuals can go to a "church" and have a "wedding" ceremony, no one is preventing them.
You are either knowingly full of it or being intentionally insulting. Likely both.
A church is entirely inconsequential to marriage. I know you believe you need the permission of a magic man in the sky to insert your penis into someone, but that is of no practical value to anyone. Including you; you just don't know it.
Marriage in the modern sense is the set of legal policies a society constructs in respect of a voluntary commitment between consenting adults. Homosexuals cannot take part in this status, for no rational reason, in part because people like you have been persuaded by the prejudiced teachings of your fairy tales that you have the right to force even non-Catholics to seek the approval of your magic buddy, to pretend that your religion owns the institution of marriage, and has the right to dictate that governments enforce it on your terms and behalf.
You seem to be going further, openly mocking gay people, compounding the insult of your support for illegitimately depriving them of equal standing in society by suggesting they should be grateful to you for the magnanimity of allowing them an ersatz costume wedding.
You are either knowingly full of it or being intentionally insulting. Likely both.
A church is entirely inconsequential to marriage. I know you believe you need the permission of a magic man in the sky to insert your penis into someone, but that is of no practical value to anyone. Including you; you just don't know it.
Marriage in the modern sense is the set of legal policies a society constructs in respect of a voluntary commitment between consenting adults. Homosexuals cannot take part in this status, for no rational reason, in part because people like you have been persuaded by the prejudiced teachings of your fairy tales that you have the right to force even non-Catholics to seek the approval of your magic buddy, to pretend that your religion owns the institution of marriage, and has the right to dictate that governments enforce it on your terms and behalf.
You seem to be going further, openly mocking gay people, compounding the insult of your support for illegitimately depriving them of equal standing in society by suggesting they should be grateful to you for the magnanimity of allowing them an ersatz costume wedding.
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